Rogue Notes | Interesting roguish tidbits lifted from for our acquisitive comrades (yeah, we're looking at you, Steve)

Tumble tumble tumble and tumble! The ability to get in and sneak attack is priceless.

Spring attack feat is Goody Goody for a thief.

You probably have to decide whether to go for an archer-rogue or a melee rogue, where you acquire P.B.shot, rapid shot, precise shot if you go for a ranged thief. This is also a very powerful combination, as a thief is usually very accurate with a bow.

1) Want to use a range weapon to make most of your sneak attacks.... take Point blanks shot ( P.B shot can only be used inside 30ft and a sneak attack must also be made inside of 30ft )

2) If your human and have DEX 13+ use your free feat to take Rapid shot at 1st level... that gives you an extra attack form 1st level when doing a full attack action ( And remember a full attack action is easy with a range weapon cause you don't often have to spend an action to close with your opponent.)

3) And even if you are not human you only have to wait 2 levels to get a new feat and then you can take Rapid shot.....

So level 1 for humans and level 3 for most others.....Those weould be 2 well spent feats for a rogue who is using his sneak attacks with a range weapon.

Get masterwork studded leather when you can afford it, and look for a mithril chain shirt if you get the chance.

Tumble skill is great for rogues, allows you to get in and out of flanking positions easily.

Dodge/Mobility/Spring Attack is also really good for getting in and out of flanking positions. Unfortunately it costs three feats. Weapon Finesse may be good, if your Dex is a lot higher than your Strength.

A Heavy Mace or Morningstar is actually a better weapon than a Rapier in most cases. The extra base damage is better than the improved critical range unless you have large fixed damage bonuses.

Second, get tumble, Mobility, or both. Move through enemy lines with your now-huge AC and flank, flank, flank.

Third, there's always the Improved Initiative & Quickdraw combo. It can actually work without those feats, but they make it all the more effective. Carry some thrown weapons. When you beat an opponents initiative score, they're flat-footed. Show them why this is bad by putting a well-placed dagger in a sensitive area.

I don't play 3e (blasphemy I know) so I can't help with feats and such, but I created a thief once who was kind of a fantasy "James West". He carried all kinds of neat little gimmicks that would compensate for the fact that he wasn't very good in combat. He wore a wide sash with hidden pockets in which he carried things like blinding powders, marbles, caltrops, etc. He wore a very long ponytail which he not only used as a weapon (I bought a proficiency) by putting a small blade in the hair ties, but he also kept an emergency lockpick in it. He had specially made spring loaded dart launchers up his sleeves. They only had a 10ft. range and did only 1 hp damage, but they were coated with a sleep poison.

And as mentioned earlier in this thread, he made copious use of the tumbling skill. I coach gymnastics for a living, so it was easy for me to be highly descriptive with this skill.

> As a rogue your prime target is enemy wizards, don't try and take the fight to fighters, they'll wipe the floor with you. Use your superior mobility to shut down spellcasters as quick as possible. Get combat reflexes. Sneak up to enemy casters if you can and wait for them to provoke an AOO, take your AOO and standard action instead of just a standard action (2 sneak attacks anyone?). Soon as you can, take 1 or 2 levels of the duellist prestige class from sword & fist to get all the weapons, your int bonus added to your AC, and the +1d6 with piercing weapons. Also consider 1 level of gladiator for the improved feint. Use skill mastery to perfect tumble so you only need a skill of 15 to move through threatened spaces without attracting AOOs (and no fail on a 1 which you get with a skill of 23 without skill mastery) also look at balance, healing for mastered skills (automatic bind wounds without a roll is useful)

If you can get your hands on a speed weapon the extra attack means you don't need spring attack - tumble in, sneak attack, tumble out - best use for a dagger of speed known to man. Ready actions to shoot enemy spellcasters whilst they are casting - their AC tends to be crap so you'll kill 2 birds with 1 stone. If you get close to a tough enemy spellcaster you don't reckon a sneak attack will drop, pick his pockets for spell components instead - that often slow 'em down.

Take adavntage of positioning: make your dm use a battlemat so you can get those all important flanks - buy him one for christmas if necesary. Your character thrives when there's someone else there to take they heat so stay near fighters and let them make the flank for you.

1. Improved Initiative is a very useful feat, especially if you don't want to commit yourself completely to either missile or melee combat. If an encounter begins within 30' and you win initiative, your opponents are all flat-footed. Even if you don't get to sneak attack, winning init gives you a chance to get out of the way if necessary, or ready missile attacks against enemy spellcasters.

2. Get a Masterwork buckler. +1 AC, no armor check penalty, and useable with either bow or rapier. I don't think you can use a shield of any kind if you finesse the rapier, though.

3. Consider multiclassing. I feel that Rogues make the best multiclasses. Don't do it at 3rd level, because you get Uncanny Dodge and +1d6 Sneak Attack then. But after that, you have some options. Fighter is always good if you want to be more useful in combat, because it gives you more HP and BAB. The bonus feat is also helpful, especially if you're working towards Sneak Attack. If you have a good enough Charisma you can consider Sorcerer, because spells like Shield and True Strike are great for rogues. Either way, only multiclass for a couple levels, so as to not dilute your sneak attack and skills too much.

> Masterwork Shields work with Weapon Finesse

Clever sod. I never spotted that. get a level of duellist for the canny defence and free proficiency with shield, and watch that ac rack up.

Question: What non-magical items do you equip your rogues with (besides thieves' tools)? What creative uses have you come up with for these mundane items when roleplaying your rogues?

From: confuseus (

Always carry chalk--it's great for leaving those taunting messages.

From: Tetsubo (

Marbles - detect slopes or slow down pursuers.

Wooden wedges - hammer it home under a door and keep the guards from getting to you quickly.

Smoke generating item - candle, cigar, fine powder , etc. - helps locate secret doors by air currents.

Good quality fake gems - bribes for the dim, distractions in crowds.

Spices - throw off things that use the Scent Feat.

Glue - a thousand uses.

Small bag of broken glass - alerts the rogue to approaching guards when they hear the "scrunch".



That's all I can think of off the top of my head.

From: neoweasel (

I ALWAYS make sure that my rogue has a disguise kit. I also like to make sure that he has something that can cause a flash of some sort, preferably with smoke. (Good for fast escapes). Marbles can be fun. Things like dry twigs that can break with a sharp noise and make it harder to sneak up behind you.

From: The Clingenpeels (

From: JDJarvis (

Stove black, or black shoe polish depending on the setting. Makes hiding easier.

Big soft socks that fit over regular soft boots, to move even quieter.

A good metal cutting saw. If no one is shooting at you you'll get through a portcullis eventually with one. some DMs figure this in the thieves tools, but some don't.

A bag of very fine powder to cover up tracks in very dusty areas.

Fishing line and short fishing pole with a couple of different hooks, there are going to be things you are going to be able to grab with this every now and then,

A tube stuffed full of pepper or some other obnoxious powdery substance, blow it into someone's face , really short ranged but it is going to surprise them and make them ineffective for a round (hopefully) . I've used it loaded with pepper and one of my fellow DMs has ruled it is a ranged touch attack and gets a DC 10 fortitude check every round for up to 3 rounds or the victim counts as dazed, not amazing but it can come in handy.

A small bell or two kept securely bound so it doesn't jingle when I travel but when unbound and rigged in place on doorjambs behind me I'll know if someone is coming , sure they'll likely realize something is up but I figure it is worth the couple of rounds I'll hopefully get out of it prepare or escape.

Glue, glue things back together after you break them and maybe the theft will go unnoticed for a while. Such as coffers and chests.

Extra potion flasks , some empty some with liquid. When You filch a potion you can pour it into one of your empty bottles and replace the original with some of your colored water you are carrying so the theft goes unnoticed or even better you enemy gets a rude suprise when they try to use a potion of healing and it just doesn't work.

A bandana or head band wioth a very strong wire in it. It is a garrote and you can wrap it around things while climbing to hold yourself in place when you have something to do that may require a spare hand.

From: Mike Benveniste (

Things not yet mentioned: Dog Biscuits-- Use is obvious. Gilded Lead Coins -- My use of this very old trick predates the Belgariad by at least 4 years. A level-- Useful for detecting slopes, also to sell to anyone who's lost one recently. Grease/Soot Mix-- Lubricant, Camo Makeup, Message Medium and emergency fuel in one. A light net-- Many uses. Wood Holy Symbol -- Buy or borrow one for the dominant religion wherever you may travel. A clothing scrap -- Not yours, of course. The more distinctive, the better.

Finally, this is technically a magic item, but a red glass bead with a magic mouth spell on it. The trigger is "If this bead is on the floor and a door closes within 10 feet." The phrase is "Hello, I'm a 10 second delayed-blast fireball." (pause} "Hello, I'm a 5 second delayed-blast fireball." (pause) "Hello, I'm a 1 second delayed-blast fireball" (pause) "Click."

From: Psychopomp (

There was a Dragon Magazine (2E) that gave several ideas for non-magic rogue items. A couple:

- Clay: you can envelop gems with this and bake it, making them look like worthless stones.

- Bagpack with secret compartments

- Mountaineers tool (don't know the name): it's a staff about 3 feet long, with on one end a pick and the other a kind of spear-tip. Usable for climbing and for fighting.

built by unclefester | sternzwischen | updated 14-05-29 23:15:26